1 2 3 4 Previous Next 51 Replies Latest reply: Nov 11, 2014 3:13 AM by rmhango@acsd.co.uk Go to original post RSS
      • 15. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

        Hi Travis


        We are in agreement but as we run clouds I thought it might be nice to have a silly name for it. Hence the term intra cloud computing. And yes there will always be an external somewhere in the chain. I remember when according to the IT magazines ATM was going to be big next year and I had ATM cards at 25Mb in PCs and I suspect that Cloud will have a contribution somewhere but to pretend it is a paradigm shift in IT is just being silly. The last big change was in 1982 when the PC appeared but I can not think of anything else since.


        Regards Conwyn

        • 16. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

          Hi guys,


            Quick question about popularity of cloud computing, what would be the price difference between running it yourself (staff + equipment) and running it remotely (WAN + cloud pricing)?

            Seems like both sides have its advantages, inter-cloud computing for small business and intra-cloud computing for large business. I understand that most of the cost comes from the staff (and all the advantages of cloud computing has been covered on Travis' post), but isn't WAN usage expensive as well? Also, the response time isn't that good either.


            Does this also mean that web hosting companies (or in fact any company with data center) can also make a little modification and call themselves cloud providers?




          • 17. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

            Hi Angela,


            I think you need to be taking a more holistic view and Travis summarises it very well, in what would be termed as a Hybrid Cloud (Combination of Private & Public), in which services can be  federated amongst one or more constituents, from an end-user perspective its just a service.


            Not only is Virtualisation an enabler, its also accelerating Cloud service adoption, along with proliferation of Web 2.0 applications. For small companies and start-ups its probably a ‘no brainer’, with larger enterprises, especially those that with invested a lot of time and money on developing in-house applications, the process will take longer, though many are already using the cloud for test and development purposes.  


            Its not about incurring costs, more about displacing them, most companies have reliable Internet access, so WAN usage doesn’t come into the equation.

            • 18. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

              Hi Angela


              I notice that fibre optic cables are being cut overnight in Nairobe and the Government spokeman  say it was sabotage.


              What happens to company who have outsourced to the cloud when that happens.


              Most Fortune 500 run their own network and treat the Internet as unpredicable.


              Other countries are build separate Internets.


              Under US Communication Act 1942 section 706d the President can close down the Internet and as we saw last April the whole Internet accidently got routed to China Telecom.


              So depending on the Internet to run critical business application may not be such a good idea.


              When you think you ROI it is important to remember business changes and handing control over to a cloud provider might provide a contractually expensive inflexible solution.


              So although cloud is a nice idea in the real world we are more focused on our business rather than creating profits for the cloud.


              I do not see how Virtualisation and Cloud are related. Anybody can buy a multi-core processor and run ESX or VMware  or even the more complex tightly coupled blade systems.


              So cloud may have specific usage such as email or social networking but there are many issues that the smiling salesman may forget to mention.


              Regards Conwyn

              • 19. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

                I think the bottom line is - some companies rely on IT to drive their business and make money, others just use it to help them out.


                I think cloud computing is going to wind up replacing most co-lo offerings, once security practices catch up.  We'll see the days of renting an actual box and choosing specific hardware to saying "we need a windows 2008 server with 32gb of RAM and 12TB of storage" and then you get an IP of the VM instance and you're up and running in 2 hours.


                Many companies co-lo services right now - especially web servers - where it's cheaper to buy bandwidth and rack space than get everything run into your own building.



                It's always going to be an exercise in cost analysis and risk management when you look at migrating to new technologies - and you'll see some markets really embrace cloud computing, while others prefer to keep it in-house.  Over the next few years I expect to find a few surprises in what companies choose what option.

                • 20. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

                  I imagine those clever marketing people give the salespeople with smiley faces a new slogan to inflict on the unsuspecting public, perhaps something like 'DRaaS? 

                  • 21. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

                    Hi R


                    Unsuspecting public perhaps but when you are responsible for multi million USD networks you have the right to ask the odd question.


                    Regards Conwyn

                    • 22. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

                      Conwyn - great point!  Million dollar network or not, anytime you're paying for the service, you can ask any question you want.  The question a vendor chooses to ignore or flat out refuse to answer, often tells you a lot about them and their practices.

                      • 23. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

                        Hi Travis


                        Also talk to the other vendor because  they always know the difficult question to ask the first vendor. Oldest trick in my book.


                        Regards Conwyn

                        • 24. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

                          Probably goes without saying and many of these discussions are already taking place, however I imagine any decisions made would be of a strategic business nature and not made in isolation, hence I don't think the network department get to make that decision and may or may not even be consulted.


                          There are many factors to be taken into consideration, most I imagine will stem from how well the Enterprise and individual business units believe they are being served by there in-house IT organisation's.


                          I'd also say many vendors, ISPs and telcos also run multi-million pound/dollar networks, supporting 10's of thousands of customers, utilising best-of-breed technology with the in-house expertise to deliver Cloud services and there are well documented use cases, where they have collaborated with each other to deliver such services.


                          Probably most applicable to this discussion would be where Cisco VMware & NetApp jointly designed what they describe as a Secure Cloud Architecture, document attached below, naturally you are free to make up your own mind as to what it is.

                          • 25. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

                            Hi R


                            Generally when external vendors are involved they love to tell the world and address conferences on how sucessful they were because that is how they generate more business. Whereas in house solution simply do it and there is no need to advertise the fact. For example when A outsources to B it is big news but when A insources then I never see the outsourcer announcing to the world they have lost yet another customer.


                            I would certain question your statement about the network team not know what is happening to the business. We are often the very first to know.


                            Nobody is saying cloud has zero value but we are saying it is simply a minor tool in delivering business solutions. It is often difficult for techie people to realise that the world is more complex than their pretty little pictures of boxs, circles and lines.


                            Regards Conwyn

                            • 26. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

                              Hi Conwyn,


                              Once again I fear you state the obvious, technology companies are indeed in the business of selling technology, just like a car manufacturer is in the business of selling cars.


                              The fact that you are now acknowledging cloud albeit 'as a minor tool for delivering business solutions' I'll take as concession, you never know, one day it might even become mainstream, especially if it lives up to the promise of being able to deliver applications cost-effectively, reliably and securely.


                              What you refer to as pretty little pictures of boxes, circles and lines, I’d say goes a long way towards formulating a proof of concept, a concept that may or may not be beneficial or even applicable to certain environments.




                              PS Incidentally, I did not say that the network team would not know what is going on with the business

                              • 27. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

                                Hi R


                                Sorry I mis-interpreted "or may not even be consulted."


                                Regards Conwyn

                                • 28. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing
                                  Scott Morris - CCDE/4xCCIE/2xJNCIE

                                  And that's an important part to understand.  Very much like when the "outsourcing" concept first started.  Great economic notes to take employees off the books, but what were the long term impacts or "unforseen consequences" of such an action.


                                  Putting things in a "cloud" is a pretty picture and perhaps a nice way to get things off your books which is all well and good until some event happens.   All that it translates to at that point in time is that someone else is responsible for your (your data's) fate.




                                  Not saying it's not a grand idea.  But see it for what it is, and take any necessary precautions and questions before jumping onto the bandwagon!



                                  • 29. Re: Virtualization and cloud computing

                                    Hi Scott,


                                    In that sense, I’d say all the more reason we should be embracing it, especially if it has the same impact as outsourcing.


                                    On the question of with whom we entrust with our data, I look at the many entities we entrust with it today and would also question the level of control the internal IT department actually has in respect of what their users are doing.


                                    However, I do accept that no new concept or technology is without its caveats, but the industry tends to address them because it has a vested interest in doing so.


                                    No doubt in my mind Cloud Computing is happening and will continue to evolve.




                                    PS Juniper to acquire Altor Networks